Thank you for sharing those research studies, super interesting (I always knew BMW owners were buttheads ;)) Do you think that research holds true across cultures and time, like it's just the human condition, or is unique to this time and place?
It is interesting. I resist the idea that because these people were ordinary they were not monsters. You can’t tell who is a monster by what they eat for breakfast or how they make small talk but everyone who commits atrocities is a monster - and yes that means we are surrounded by people who are/could be monsters, that’s uncomfortable so we pretend it’s not true. But I don’t find it that disturbing that a minority of regular people are monstrous. I wonder what the gender break down is both in the atrocity prone minority and the resistant minority is.
Plato wrote that in a hailstorm, even the good shepherd seeks shelter behind a wall. To require people to display extraordinarily heroic and even suicidal qualities in a dilemma to prove that they are not cowards, is fallacious.
When Epictetus's student asks him about pleasing an important man, he replies, "...I for my part have someone whom I must please, whom I must submit to, whom I must obey, namely, God, and after him, myself." (Discourses 4.12)
It never occurs to the Stoic's theoretical sage to follow the herd. To the non philosopher, it's only natural.
But to us humans who have decided to improve, we're aware of how foolish society and it's great people are, and yet navigating social pressures remains no easy feat.
Ultimately, it always comes down acting and thinking in alignment with our values.
“Avoid fraternizing with non-philosophers. If you must, though, be careful not to sink to their level; because, you know, if a companion is dirty, his friends cannot help but get a little dirty too, no matter how clean they started out.” (Enchiridion 33.6)
I am curious about the outliers. Unfortunately, outside of lab experiments, that outliers don't tend to survive too long.
I think it's just part of the human condition. Underneath all of our progress, we're still just animals haha.
Thank you for sharing those research studies, super interesting (I always knew BMW owners were buttheads ;)) Do you think that research holds true across cultures and time, like it's just the human condition, or is unique to this time and place?
Nice. Contempt destroys all relationships, of every kind.
Very very much so.
It is interesting. I resist the idea that because these people were ordinary they were not monsters. You can’t tell who is a monster by what they eat for breakfast or how they make small talk but everyone who commits atrocities is a monster - and yes that means we are surrounded by people who are/could be monsters, that’s uncomfortable so we pretend it’s not true. But I don’t find it that disturbing that a minority of regular people are monstrous. I wonder what the gender break down is both in the atrocity prone minority and the resistant minority is.
yanina, you raise a compelling point about the nature of those who commit atrocities.
It's unsettling to think that ordinary people can harbor monstrous tendencies, and it's something society often prefers to ignore.
I guess it's human nature after all.
“I'm not your average human being, I'm on deeper things
We're all puppets, I'm a puppet who can see the strings
Seeing is believing, if I see him I believe in him
If God is real where is he, l want to speak to him”
-Mr. Traumatik-
Plato wrote that in a hailstorm, even the good shepherd seeks shelter behind a wall. To require people to display extraordinarily heroic and even suicidal qualities in a dilemma to prove that they are not cowards, is fallacious.
When Epictetus's student asks him about pleasing an important man, he replies, "...I for my part have someone whom I must please, whom I must submit to, whom I must obey, namely, God, and after him, myself." (Discourses 4.12)
It never occurs to the Stoic's theoretical sage to follow the herd. To the non philosopher, it's only natural.
But to us humans who have decided to improve, we're aware of how foolish society and it's great people are, and yet navigating social pressures remains no easy feat.
Ultimately, it always comes down acting and thinking in alignment with our values.
“Avoid fraternizing with non-philosophers. If you must, though, be careful not to sink to their level; because, you know, if a companion is dirty, his friends cannot help but get a little dirty too, no matter how clean they started out.” (Enchiridion 33.6)
Yeah, I consider myself fortunate to not be drawn to the herd.
I can’t say the same for most, and maybe I’m delusional about it, but my goal is always to think and try to be aware of any biases creeping in.
It is good to be self aware of personal bias.
The studies confirm that about 1/4 of people are leSs inclined to harm others.
Authoritarian pressure is hard to resist.
I believe an examination of the outliers in the studies would show that even that 1/4 would show some marked differences.